Free Republic bans Giuliani boosters

The conservative website Free Republic has banned supporters of Rudy Giuliani, according to the New York Observer:

[Free Republic has] experienced one of the biggest internal battles to rock the site since the 2000 election of George W. Bush -- a tumultuous campaign year that nearly tore the site apart, as its founder and chief administrator first cleansed commenting ranks of Bush supporters, then, later, rallied to his support.

At the heart of the latest controversy: the fight over the conservative bona fides of Rudy Giuliani.

Over the past few weeks, chaos has reigned in the “Freeper” community as members sympathetic to the former mayor's candidacy claim to have suffered banishment from the site. They were victimized, they say, by a wave of purges designed to weed out any remaining support for the Giuliani campaign on the popular conservative web forum. Another significant chunk of commenters have migrated away from the controversial site over the action, according to a number of former site members and conservative bloggers who have been tracking the situation.

In a plaintive post on the blog “Sweetness & Light,” exiled commenter Steve Gilbert, who says he does not support the former mayor’s campaign, blasted the site’s new “anti-Giuliani, anti-abortion jihad.” Since George W. Bush was elected president, he wrote, “there haven’t been any large scale [Free Republic] purges to speak of – until now.” [NYO]

This does not bode well for Giuliani's chances with the Republican base.

The fight began one month ago, when site founder Jim Robinson posted an anti-Giuliani manifesto titled: “Giuliani as the GOP presidential nominee would be a dagger in the heart of the conservative movement.” Then the virtual ax started to swing. Longtime posters to the freewheeling discussion threads, used to serious no-holds-barred web etiquette, were still stunned by the intensity of the anti-Rudy activity; conservative blogs buzzed with the development. [NYO]

Imagine if every conservative voter in America knew as much about Giuliani as New Yorkers and Freepers.

HT: Thad.

Comments

[Jeffg]

Sounds about right ..
Much like the Party they pander to; they have major issues with things like free speech and dissent. Personally I don't see the draw for the site. I haven't seen any of the American Principles professed actually put into practice. And it really just comes off as another wild rant page.

[DJA]

I love the photo that accompanies the NY Observer article so much. It encapsulates everything you need to know about New York mayoral politics from 1994-present.

[mudkitty]

Gotta love the freepers, though - they're the canary in the mine shaft. It's good to have them out in the open where you can see them for who they are.

[The Phantom]

None of this will hurt Giuliani.

I've thought for over a year that his more difficult task will be to get the GOP Nomination, and that if he accomplishes that, he will wipe the floor with any conceivable Democratic Party opponent.

I believe that he will poll vastly better in the GOP "base" than one might expect--and that he will do far better among registered Northeast/California Democrats and, yes liberals than any Republican candidate in the last 30-40 years.

Reports like this do not hurt him with Republicans and may help him with Democrats and Independents.

Rudy absolutely confounds all traditional party and political labels. "Liberal" and "conservative" are somewhat irrelevant here.

My feelings are not based on research, they are based on "gut". I know a lot of liberals/Dems in NYC and Pennsylvania who I expect to vote for Rudy, maybe even send money to him, etc.

I'll forward the Observer article to them. Thanks.

[Alon Levy]

If party base forums were indicative of primary results, Dean would've gotten the nomination in 2004 in a cakewalk. Democratic Underground was pro-Dean right up until Kerry won, when the admins started to enforce a pro-Kerry line. The second most supported candidate on DU was Kucinich; whoever was third - maybe Clark, but I'm not sure - ran far behind Dean and Kucinich.

[dr2chase]

I'm a liberal, who happens to be located in the Northeast, and I won't be voting for Giuliani, or any other Republican candidate. They seem to live in some sort of crazy fantasy world -- this whole bit about fighting them there so they won't attack us here is nuts.

But it could be a campaign slogan, I guess -- "Giuliani, not crazy enough for the Free Republic". Maybe the Freepers are pro-ferret.

[Dunc]

Ah, but it's good to see the fractious nature of the right coming to the fore...

[mudkitty]

Trust me...I make a study of the right wing, and Guliani will never get the nod. EVER.

[Jill Bains]

"...and that he will do far better among registered Northeast/California Democrats and, yes liberals than any Republican candidate in the last 30-40 years." -(The Phantom, remarking on Guliani).

-Very true. A remarkably prescient observation attesting to the vacuity of the Liberal soul and the rightist truth of their political nature, if not the essence of the American political character itself.

The political opportunism of liberals will always veer right, instead of left; they will destroy the left first if 'push came to shove,' and make solidarity with the right.

Scratch a liberal you find a conservative: scratch the conservative you find the fascist.

This continuum is cut from whole cloth; the colors of the fabric may change but the end result is the same: Fascism.

Regular folk always are aghast with disbelief when they try to account for how and why George Bush was elected? These good Americans just fail to understand the dynamic I have described above, nor can they: It simply does not matter if Giuliani is elected or Al Gore. America is a death state always driven by a fascism with its own impetus, no matter how benignly it may be concealed with fel gtood 'Green' nostrums.

What's all this talk about 'the right' not allowing for a Guliani presidency?

The real point is that it is all 'the right.' All of it. America would simply cease to exist as we know it if its essentialist fascism was expunged.

[mudkitty]

Regular folk know that Bush stole Florida 2000.

[Alon Levy]

Aeroman, I think this shatters your theory about the Jill Bains bot. Rants about how everyone who's not a radical leftist is really a fascist and postmodern babble tend not to mix that often.

Mudkitty, regular folk know that rants about election stealing are for losers. The best thing that can happen to the Democratic Party is a Gore campaign that takes the same form as Gore's recent activism. The worst thing that can happen to it is a Gore campaign based on a "Re-elect Gore" theme.

[Jill Bains]

"Regular folk know that Bush stole Florida 2000." -(mudkitty)

-No, they don't know. You wish they knew. As do I. However I know that if they did know, nothing would be different.

As many that do know, and just as many that don't know-the variance is of no relevance whatsoever.

It is not about knowledge or 'facts,' but what exists before and beyond facts, and is unreachable by facts.

"Men are deceived in their knowledge of things that are manifest-even as Homer was, although he was the wisest of all Greeks, For he was even deceived by boys killing lice when they said to him: "What we have seen and grasped, these we leave behind; whereas what we have not seen and grasped, these we carry away." -(Heraclitis, Fragment 91)

[Jill Bains]

"The best thing that can happen to the Democratic Party is a Gore campaign that takes the same form as Gore's recent activism."

-(Alon Levy)

Juvenile, sophomoric sentimentality of no utility whatsoever and even less credibility. This has all the laughable gravitas of a high school cheer leading squad, none of which look remotely like Jennifer Aniston.

I have heard, perhaps apocryphally, that nearly 70% of all the women in
America who named daughters Jennifer,within the last year, did so because of Jennifer Aniston.

Now there's gravitas for you. And it has little to do with Al Gore's 'Green' pandering to the suburban, white 'Soccer mom' vote.

If you do not understand Jennifer Aniston, you do not understand America.

[mudkitty]

AL - why you concern troll you. With advice like that, well let's just say, that taking advice from "well wishers" such as yourself, now that would be stupid.

Tell us about it. Tell us all about it. Give us your solid insider advice, AL.

[Alon Levy]

The reason I concern troll is simple. It makes the members of the echo chamber start ranting about concern trolls, which makes them more paranoid and less receptive to any criticism from people who don't use the correct shibboleths. That has two effects: first, it marginalizes the fringe, and second, it gives shrill people something to do, keeping them away from serious politics, where they could do real damage.

[Jim Robinson]

Rudy is a better man than me. That is why I hate him so. Its really more of a reflection of my own insecurities than it is of Rudy's leadership abilitites. I treated George W Bush the same way. I am just a miserable SOB.

[mudkitty]

And it's all on your shoulders AL.

[Jill Bains]

"...it gives shrill people something to do, keeping them away from serious politics, where they could do real damage." -Alon Levy

-You only wish I was 'shrill' Alon. You would like it if it were so. But since it isn't ,you have to come out with tired blogospheric boilerplate adjectives of dismissal and disparagement so your well conditioned readers would have something trite they can understand. Pick another adjective Alon, you are becoming a bore.

But this is the funniest thing of all: "...keeping them away from SERIOUS politics." You mean an Al Gore candiacy is serious politics? Electing a billionaire is SERIOUS politcs?

As far as 'real damage' Alon, the slavish mediocrity of your politics can't bear anything more 'real' than the prideful, unknowing servitude you so gracefully labor under.

You're in the realm of pabulum and baby food Alon.

Baby food.

"The unrecognized greatness of this ritual defilement which symbolized a nostalgia for infinite defilement cannot be overrated." -(Georges Bataille, "Literature And Evil.")

And that’s where the diapers come in for you Alon.

[aeroman]

Alon, I'm going to hypothesize that that original post was made when the fun-loving prankster behind the "Jill Bains" character was either drunkenly ad-libbing or testing a new version of the Bainsbot.

[Larry Ray]

How Bush, the Far Right, and Big Business Are Betraying Americans for Power and Profit

Let’s take a very close, very honest look at what’s been going on in this country, the United States of America, and let’s see what we can come up with. A relatively recent federal criminal investigation of Kerik waves a HUGE RED FLAG about the unexplainable decisions made by President Bush, Vice President Cheney, the Republican front-runner to replace him (Giuliani) and Attorney General Gonzales. Thinking back on how Giuliani put forward a flawed candidate for high office, how Bush rushed the usual process in his eagerness to install a political ally and how Gonzales, as White House counsel, failed to stop the nomination despite the many warning signs of which Julie Meyers was aware well in advance. Obviously, then, Gonzales rushed in to take the vetting process into his own hands with the objective of making sure the nomination was not stopped and to prevent the public outrage that was coming at the Bush administration should the public’s suspicion prove true that our own President put a pathetic, uneducated criminal in the most powerful position of the president’s cabinet all just to serve his sinister purpose of gaining a political ally to do his dirty work from the position that would be easiest.

I don’t know if anybody’s noticed, but Bush’s entire presidential foundation rests on what he has our troops doing in Iraq with this ridiculous “War on Terror.” Come on, what better position to promote and validate that “War on Terror” than HOMELAND SECURITY?!?!? Wars make money, that’s been true throughout the history of this country – we all learn about it in grade school and high school – a wartime economy is a flourishing one. Lately, one big question buzzing amongst the people has been, well, then what the hell happened here? Haha. This war is making plenty of money. For Bush and the Bush administration – Cheney, Giuliani, Kerik, Gonzales… come on, these guys are doing business, baby! They’re making big money! They’re rolling in the $$$$$. It’s an enterprise. A Criminal Enterprise. What are the American people doing in the mean time? Getting played. What are the American troops doing “over there”? Dying. For what noble cause did our good old President Bush send these young men and women to Iraq? To put money in his pocket of course. That’s right, moms and dads, brothers and sisters of those brave young men and women who were sent to Iraq based on a lie – it’s your sons and daughters lives, your brother’s and sister’s lives that are being traded off to fatten up the wallets of some very crafty, very sinister criminals who wear suits and strut around Capitol Hill committing crimes and debasing everything that makes the United States of America a wonderful and honorable country – a country “for the People, by the People.” Oh but don’t worry, Bush isn’t a rude guy – he’s sharing the wealth with his buddies in the Bush administration who are members of a criminal political enterprise built up by and in the Republican party. Now that some of the bad apples are finally falling off the tree, the truth is seeping out around the edges of the lies that cloaked the Bush administration – a strong lesson can be learned here, - when you’re too arrogant, your criminal activity inevitably gets messy. Apparently, a person who reaches this level of arrogance wouldn’t recognize his cue to “quit while you’re ahead” even if it smacked him between the eyebrows. People are resigning left and right. What does Bush do? Well, it’s his typical move when things get rocky and his speed + secrecy formula doesn’t work. It’s just what he did with having Gonzales personally take charge of the vetting process when information about Kerik’s not-so-clean background leaked out in the press at the time of the Homeland Security Nomination. Bush turns to the aid of one of his cronies, his political allies, his partners in crime, whatever you want to call them, and has them validate his actions. This time, when everyone is questioning the war in Iraq harder than ever, and some Democrats out there on Capitol Hill are finally trying to put their foot down and refuse giving Bush whatever the hell he wants, specifically more funding for his “War on Terrorism.” What does Bush do in response? He announces that he will veto any funding that doesn’t last him more than the next few months, and – out of nowhere – appoints “War Czars.” What the hell is a War Czar? I love how Bush just makes up all these special little positions that oh-so-conveniently fit perfectly into a solution to get him out of a shameful political pickle. Well, I would be willing to bet a pretty penny that these War Czars are going to conveniently agree with, substantiate and validate Bush’s firm stand on his decision to stay in Iraq longer. I don’t know, I could be wrong, but it just seems to fit the pattern.

The opportunity presents itself now to hold Bush, Cheney, Giuliani, Kerik, Tenet, Wolfowitz, Greenspan, Gonzales, and plenty more involved responsible for the mess they have made of this country both at home and in foreign affairs. America must seize the opportunity and demand the whole truth about the scandals these men have been pulling off on us behind our backs. Don’t forget, these men are scrambling to make sure America does not get the whole truth – that’s the only way they can save themselves from suffering the consequences of their actions – crimes committed behind closed doors.

My real serious question is, Will America merely accept the façade Bush fabricates for us yet again, or will we wise up this time? It seems we have been more and more. And I have to say, I have been rooting for all of my fellow citizens here in America, because I have a lot of respect for this country and the people in it. We should be proud to be Americans. Don’t forget, the people who came to this country and made us the United States of America – our Forefathers – were people who came here emotionally beat up and battered, and they established what became the most powerful country in the world! The evolution of this country is very much infused with a Darwinistic survival of the fittest dynamic. There is something to be said for that. We Americans pioneered so much from the industrial revolution right up to the huge forum of business and culture in what has become one of the capitols of the world – our very own New York City. Trust me, people, it was New York City long before Rudolph Giuliani. He didn’t make it, he didn’t bring it the sense of community New Yorkers feel, and he certainly didn’t rescue it –He defiled it. A New Yorker has always been a New Yorker, long before Rudy Giuliani was even born. As a New Yorker myself, I know we are not the type to tolerate his lies. I don’t care how many glorified pictures we have of him waving and looking self-righteous in the midst of the debris that was the Twin Towers. The only thing Rudy Giuliani ever did for NYC was disgrace it and offend its people by fooling them for a few years.
Giuliani possesses what I like to call the allure of toxic leaders. Let’s face it, in most cases, we choose our bad leaders, they do not kidnap us. We choose them because they soothe our fears. Giuliani’s political career was plummeting downwards until one decisive day that turned everything around – 9/11. Ever since then, he has done a masterful job of manipulating the American people. He took up the role of America’s Mayor and suddenly became an expert on terrorism. First of all, I personally have gone to other countries and done counter terrorism work (counter terrorism is what I have been doing for over twenty years – I work in Intelligence for the CIA and DIA), and I can assure you that Rudy Giuliani can walk around Ground Zero in clouds of smoke all he wants, but that’s all the Rudy Giuliani the American public knows is – clouds of smoke. One thing that stands out in Giuliani’s political career is his recommendation of Bernard Kerik for Homeland Security. It’s not at all difficult to see that Kerik is at best “a flawed candidate” – he didn’t even graduate high school, he is the son of a prostitute and he grew up a street-smart criminal in Passaic County. We all know that Kerik is a criminal now though, because Kerik has already been arrested twice, indicted and is currently under federal investigation – and that’s only the tip of the ice-berg. As Washington Post notes, “After Kerik withdrew, Ray became the central witness in several investigations.” Ray refers to Larry Ray, - that’s me. I am the man responsible for a lot of what you have been seeing on the news lately including the exposure of Cheney and Gonzales. I had to start by exposing Bernie (Kerik) and continue from there. After I released the information I had about Kerik in Nov. ’04, an already vicious campaign Bush, Cheney, Giuliani, Kerik, Gonzales, and Chris Christy had going on against me to discredit and destroy me suddenly took a sharp turn into something brutal to get to me by torturing my children. For more of the truth and easy ways that you can help bring it out to the rest of our fellow Americans without even having to move from your computer, go to my site:

http://www.truthwins.info/vice-president-cheneytake-down-this-corruption/

When I think of Bush and his associates, one word comes to mind: PREMEDITATED.

You want to know where the crimes are? Just look at any Bush administration appointments and ask the question, “What is the utility to George Bush and Dick Cheney?” Next question, “What is the quid pro quo?”

I would like to send my prayers out to all those who we remember on Memorial Day, including those whom we have recently lost in Iraq. God bless those brave souls, and God bless their families. God forgive those who have lied to get us into war with Iraq to begin with and who continue to lie to keep us there.

Faithfully,
Larry Ray