Please visit the new home of Majikthise at bigthink.com/blogs/focal-point.

« Labor unions and private equity firms | Main | Feministe loses powerful voice »

June 10, 2007

"Pro-life" e-Cards

Ecard_2

Post-abortion greetings from the head Heather. She cares about you, really.

The above is one of the many online greetings available from The Pro-Life ECard center where you can "show your love and concern by sending a FREE e-card to a mother or father who has lost a baby to abortion."

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
https://www.typepad.com/services/trackback/6a00d8341c61e653ef00df35234b4c8834

Listed below are links to weblogs that reference "Pro-life" e-Cards:

Comments

What sin? What sin Dave? What sin? Are you accusing me of sin? What do you mean by sin? And who are you Dave, to accuse someone else of sin? But first Dave, tell me, what sin?

*****

Hate the sin/love the sinner - this from a "non-believer." See what I mean about mole vs troll?

That's right! Dave actually did tell suggest I should "off" myself. I almost forgot amongst all the other bullshit comments he's posted, but that's true.

Thanks CountZ.

Mudkitty you are without a doubt the biggest fucking idiot ever, it is in reference to your "You called me disgusting because you called the act of getting multiple abortions disgusting" that is all.

For example I hate the fact that my friend smokes pot. So now do I hate him as well according to your logic. No I do not.

I told Count to pull his head from his third point of contact, maybe when he is done he can assist you!

Mudkitty you are without a doubt the biggest fucking idiot ever, it is in reference to your "You called me disgusting because you called the act of getting multiple abortions disgusting" that is all.

For example I hate the fact that my friend smokes pot. So now do I hate him as well according to your logic. No I do not.

I told Count to pull his head from his third point of contact, maybe when he is done he can assist you!

For all you pseudo-constitutionalists out there, may I remind you that abortion was legal at the time of the writing of the United States Constitution.

*****

"Like hippies dancing naked in the streets"...that barely happened in the sixties...Jeez Louise...now I see where you're coming from...Reefer Madness anyone?

*****

As for marriage being a right, it isn't for gay couples.

Mudkitty you are without a doubt the biggest fucking idiot ever . . . I hate the fact that my friend smokes pot.

Damn Dave, roll yourself a nice big joint and relax man.

Yeah Think, I get it. We’re not helping the cause by being too in-your-face with Mr. average, mossback, god-fearing J. Q. Public. Thing is, we’re just about sick of living our entire lives sotto voce so as not to offend the delicate sensibilities of the reactionaries. Where I live there are huge “pro-life” billboards, the graveyards have memorials to the “murdered unborn”, the church marquees condemn the “baby-killers”, etc. And that’s an issue people in rural N.W. USA are not even particularly passionate about. Park a car out in the woods when you go for a hike with bumper stickers advocating gun control or dissing the Iraq crusade, and you should not be surprised to find the headlights smashed when you return.

All this is moot anyhow. With the Supreme Court as presently constituted, and the country transfixed with religion, Roe Vs. Wade is lost anyhow. We will have to wait until virtually every American has personally experienced, or has family, or a very close friend affected by the draconian abortion laws that are surely on their way. The whole battle will have to be fought all over again, from scratch, in about thirty years when (and if) the current Jesus frenzy has burned itself out.

"Like hippies dancing naked in the streets"...that barely happened in the sixties...Jeez Louise...now I see where you're coming from...Reefer Madness anyone?

Sorry, never saw that one. Can't help you there.

I've read that many 60s "activists" in retrospect wish they would have downplayed the hippie-look-what-we-can-do-just-to-do-it aspect of their movement in favor of more constructive, thought-out efforts that would have longer-lasting impact. Same with the current gay rights movement. Pissing people off just for the sake of pissing them off... never a good strategy. It's the payback, man. It's a bitch. But you won't bear those costs ... the blue women in the red states will, right?

As for marriage being a right, it isn't for gay couples.

Well, Duh.
You can sit and cry about it -- go have a tantrum in the street -- or you can educate yourself and consider which steps will bring us closer to that goal. Ill-considered moves bring backlash, which can be fine if you know it's coming and can withstand it, or it can be crippling in terms of strategic legal moves = constitutional amendments that can set movements back in time, affecting the choices of a generation or more.

It's easy to agree on the fight. I suspect some of you here are still at that stage -- culling yourselves out from more conservative or mainstream views. But once you've identified your target, your goal, then the work is just beginning in figuring out how to best secure your goals for the maximum numbers of American people. We disagree clearly, but people learn and grow. If you think my support of abortion rights is shaky, I think you are wrong. But that's not what's being discussed here; it took a more strategic turn in their somewhere, just like these e-cards are a (sad) strategic PR move.

If you think my support of abortion rights seems "shaky", consider how many people less committed than me you risk turning off by comparing your right to have an abortion to your right to vote, protest segregation, or speak out. Just because you have a right doesn't mean you have to continually practice it; you have to work to make sure that right is secure if/when it is truly needed. So screeching obscenities, dropping your pants and pissing in the street just for the sake of it -- looking to turn others off who are actually on the side of freedoms practiced responsibly -- is a price paid by later generations, see 60s to 80s culture.

C-Frost, you can fight the whole thing 30 years from now under the current system....Me I am hoping for a revolution.

Your support of abortion rights, I suggest, is not just shaky, but disingenuous. You clearly haven't thought it through.

Standing up for ones rights does not cause harm to the reproductive rights movement. What causes harm to the cause is reticence, and apologizing for abortion. There's not a damn thing wrong with abortion. Not standing firm for ones rights, and for the facts, is what causes harm.

As for dropping one's pants, and pissing in the streets...where do you come up with that shit? Who the hell is talking about doing anything like that? This is a fantasy that springs from YOUR brain.

"Just for the sake of it?" Since when do you equate women fighting, and standing firm for their reproductive rights, and not backing down, with pissing in the streets, or hippies dancing naked? How does that equate? The comparison alone is an insult to the entire reproductive rights movement.

Yeah, we women fight for our rights "just for the sake of it."

The last time I saw people pissing in the streets and hippies dancing naked was...? As if that had anything to do with anything even remotely real.

Me I am hoping for a revolution.

Aren't we all. Put a wish in one hand and shit in the other . . .

Just because you have a right doesn't mean you have to continually practice it; you have to work to make sure that right is secure if/when it is truly needed.

And when will you know if a right is "truly needed", since that is not an aspect addressed in the enumeration of a right? Well, just sit down and let the guys figure out. You don't have to worry your pretty little heads about it.

It's a brilliant solution. I can't imagine why any woman would feel like her rights are subordinate to your whims with the rhetoric you're pushing, "ThinkItThroughNow...".

Don't twist what I said.

Try to imagine the difference between practicing your "right" to abort, and practicing the right to vote.

Do multiple abortions make you a better woman, like the person who is a perpetual voter? Cuz some here seem to imply that.

Use a bit of common sense. Realize that if you're not smart enough to use prevention, at least use discretion when advertising of your multiple right to abort. I predict in years to come, depending on where you live, such actions will seem more like privileges than rights, sadly enough.

But hurry. Go have an abortion because if you don't use it, you lose it, seems to be the thinking of some here...

There's not a damn thing wrong with abortion.

And there's not a damn thing wrong with birth control. Or pregnancy prevention. Or ... common sense.

ThinkItThroughNow?

As for dropping one's pants, and pissing in the streets...where do you come up with that shit? Who the hell is talking about doing anything like that?

Actually, it's a saying. The 60s generation later said, many of them, that in retrospect looking back from the perspective of the 80s, perhaps it would have been better to have used more common sense, been more focused in their goals, rather than purposely trying to piss people off by dancing in the streets naked.

Give it time. I suspect some will look back at the abortion movement in the same way, if/when things start to become more restrictive for some women in many places. Then, suddenly the idea of taking responsibility for your body BEFORE having to continually rely on abortions, will seem like a pretty simple idea. Tone it down so that you don't NEED to have multiple abortions per woman per lifetime. If you take the precautions of not seeding your garden, there will be less little seedlings to uproot in the future. Not that there's anything wrong with uprooting seedlings, some say. But hey -- why not just prevent them from germinating in the first place? Or would you rather just piss in the street naked and tell the world about it ... because you can? Or because it's somehow noble to practice this right?

So who said there was anything wrong with birth control? Who said there was anything wrong with pregnancy prevention or common sense? No one. Don't pretend anyone here - not a single soul here said there was anything wrong with those things. That is a deflection from the issue which is there is nothing wrong with abortion, and you seem to think there is. You are doing nothing for the pro-choice cause, if you really are for the pro-choice cause, which I seriously doubt, by apologizing for abortion.

You seem very interested in how people conduct their sex lives, however. Do this...don't do that...

When are you going to get it that the number of abortions a woman has, be it zero or multiple, is none of your business? When are you going to grasp that concept? Because unless you grasp that concept, you're whole approach is that of an insincere concern troll (if that's not an oxymoron.)

Ah, but if we all had your mentality we'd all be worried about naked dancing hippies and people pulling their pants down and pissing in the streets, as if that equated to a womans right to reproductive freedom, no apologies.

BTW - in case you didn't know, someone should finally clue you in on the fact that pissing in the streets is not a right.

Truly unbelievable. Why are you so concerned with pissing in the streets? Is that what you would do, if you felt it was your right? Seriously, I don't get it? How do you equate that with human rights?

"When are you going to get it that the number of abortions a woman has, be it zero or multiple, is none of your business? When are you going to grasp that concept? Because unless you grasp that concept, you're whole approach is that of an insincere concern troll (if that's not an oxymoron.)"

Ahhhhh yes that is the answer to anyone that does not agree with you.


"BTW - in case you didn't know, someone should finally clue you in on the fact that pissing in the streets is not a right.

Truly unbelievable. Why are you so concerned with pissing in the streets? Is that what you would do, if you felt it was your right? Seriously, I don't get it? How do you equate that with human rights?"


BTW - Stop being a fucking idiot. Try actually reading the posts you are responding to.

That is a deflection from the issue which is there is nothing wrong with abortion, and you seem to think there is. You are doing nothing for the pro-choice cause...

There IS something wrong with a college-educated woman who "has to" undergo more than two abortions. Particularly with and "I don't even think about it" attitude.

This person is choosing abortion AS primary birth control. They can't waste a minute to ask why their earlier birth control, if used, may have failed them.

They are so certain that abortion as birth control will always be available to all American women that they can't be bothered to learn more about PREVENTING pregnancy in the first place.

Don't preach to me. Educate the women who think like this. Or else, just like those hippies who thought their day would never end, you and your multiple abortions and non-thinking attitudes will turn off those who might otherwise be pro choice. If it comes to popular vote, you're going to need those pro-choice people too.

If you sound like you can't handle the responsibilities of choice -- if you keep treating your body like a henhouse to incubate then pluck the eggs, rather than preventing fertilization in the first place, well don't be too surprised when your "right" or more likely that of some lesser woman living elsewhere, is GONE. Then, just like the hippies who wished maybe they had employed some common sense and not just gone looking to tick people off with their unthinking irresponsibility, you might just realize what's been lost. If you sense today what's at stake, maybe you can curtail your behaviour before you lose these "rights" and you have to look back in shock at what you've potentially lost. Hence, the comparison to amending the state constitutions to prevent same-sex marraige, or at least delay it for a generation or so.

<8>When are you going to get it that the number of abortions a woman has, be it zero or multiple, is none of your business?

Hey -- I'm not the one bragging on a publically accessible board about all the abortions I've had and how I don't even care enough to spend a minute or two thinking how not to get myself in that position again. Capiche? Do what you must, but think PR. Future generations of women are counting on us to be smart and responsible. Hence, the "pissing in the streets" analogy that seems to have gone over your head, perhaps due to your youth and lack of historical nuance.

I wish more women would think of abortion as insurance.

You practice primary birth control if you are not ready for the potential consequences of fertilization. If it fails, or if you are raped, or if your child is going to be born with medical deformities-- it's a nice insurance policy to have. You truly need to exercise your choices then -- to bear or not to bear.


To me, the greatest tragedy would be that women do not have this option when they truly need it and have nothing else to fall back on.

I fear that publicizing the examples of women who have exercised this option over and over -- without thinking about it -- not so much because they were put in those circumstances and had no choice, but because they were too foolish or stubborn to educate themselves how not to get in that final decision-making situation, will take away "rights" from women in the earlier group, if this thing should go to a state-by-state vote.

If you can help protect that right for all, by educating yourself better about timing and birth control methods and taking extra precautions if necessary, would you?

Would you take that extra minute or two, or admit that you don't understand really how conception works and need to learn more, if that left the abortion option available to other women who were unable to take such precautions, for whatever reason, and find themselves in need of an abortion -- for the first time ever, say?

If you think of it like that, you look selfish here mudkitty. Sadly, I predict that legally with this Court, one day it will be a PR battle with all of us working to convince others why the right of a woman to decide all her bodily choices is so important. Those in opposition to that are going to pluck your words off sights like this as examples of how even educated young women aren't responsible enough to use their "rights" wisely, so they should be lost to all.

And then maybe you'll understand all those hippies who later regretted the naked dancing in the street when the other side shoved back. Think about the women who don't have all the education and financial/cultural support as you. That's who will be the real loser here if abortion gets tossed back to the states. Use some common sense before you go publicizing your sex life and abortion history is all I'm saying. If we can't change your behavior, at least think of who will bear the cost of your ill flung words.

ps.

Did you ever notice that the poorer kids with less in insurance tend to smash their cars up less than the richer kids who know they have an excellent insurance policy that will fully reimburse them so they'll be out driving in a new vehicle in a week, no questions asked.

Why do you think that is? I think it has something to do with being risk averse, knowing that if you perform badly there are consequences and loss.

If you're so sure you have nothing to lose, I suspect you don't change your driving habits and you get in a lot more "accidents" than those who have a lot more at stake.

(Let's see if this analogy goes down easier than the hippie one.)

Finally,
I encourage some of you to think ahead of how you'd discuss this issue were it up for popular legislative vote in your state. (Or if you were working outside your state in another culture where the "right" would be determined locally.)

Now, think of that discussion with well meaning, good-hearted people who consider themselves pro-woman and therefore pro-choice, but who would never label themselves pro-abortion. (Meaning they'd never consider it a "blessing" and you might be hard pressed to move them past "a tragedy", because they keep thinking of the pregnant women they know and were learning of their pregnancies, and how in 6 or 7 months a new life joined the family/community.

These women, especially those with a little life experience under the belt, will respect the pro-choice part. All our lives are different. You make your choices; I make mine, depending on what's best for us. And we each know ourselves best.

If you can respect these women in return, you'll get their vote for the pro-choice part. Although on an individual level, I bet they'd work to convince you of adoption, or having the baby that things will look brighter in months to come and the extended community/family could help to provide... Still, I think they would respect that in cases of rape, ill timing, or individual problems where someone is not fit to bear a child, the choice should remain.

But it should be used sparingly, this crowd's common sense would say. And no matter how you talk until you're blue in the face, you'll never get them to be Pro-Abortion, a Blessing.

No, the best you can hope for is not to lose these potentiall Pro-Choice voters because you have already chosen to write them off, alienate them with your rhetoric, examples, and making enemies out of them before you even know them, their concerns or cultures.

I'm not writing off any pro-choicers, or potential pro-choicers...that's what you do, thoughtlessly, when you apologize for abortion rights. You, thoughtless, are no pro-choicer or potential one. You think abortion is a tragedy, which it isn't. You find it distasteful at the very least. You come here pretending to be pro-choice, as a concern troll, trying to tell real pro-choicers how to get people on their side; but your advice is bad advice - like Karl Rove, trying to give dems advice as to how to recapture the white house in '08. This apologetic attitude is what got the pro-choice movement into the "shaky" state it's in now.

"Women treating their bodies like hen houses?" Where do you come up with this crazy stuff?

No one here is bragging about how many abortions they've had, and I'm just stating facts. You don't know the circumstances of the abortions, you know nothing of my "cultural/financial" support...but you go on opining just the same.

If we're going to talk about political spin and PR, as opposed to fundamental human rights (as apparently we are, to the extent that anything meaningful is being discussed in this thread), the second-worst thing women can do is to be meekly apologetic about their abortions, offering up excuses and extenuating circumstances.

The very worst thing women can do is to remain silent, never mention their abortion(s), allow "abortion" to be a faceless "issue" rather than a reality of the lives of real women.

I'd like to see T-shirts that say, "I had four live births, one stillbirth and one abortion", "I had one live birth and two abortions", and so on.

"'Women treating their bodies like hen houses?' Where do you come up with this crazy stuff?"

Its one of the oldest hoariest patriarchal cliches/ projections; you can find versions of this statement (and the disgust it implies) on Sumerian tablets. If women have full autonomy, their fecundity will bring social chaos and every sort of horror, especially the horror of bodily corruption (those hippies dancing naked and pissing in the streets). And this neurosis is what every major pro-life organization is about, NOT protecting innocent little unborn tykes; just as the the vast majority of self-identified 'pro-life' voters also support abstinence education, and restrictions on or outright elimination of birth control even in view of the evidence that this will result in more abortions.

Don't twist what I said.

I'm not twisting what you said, just drawing the obvious conclusion.

Try to imagine the difference between practicing your "right" to abort, and practicing the right to vote.

Okay...I'm not seeing it. As far as I'm concerned, both these rights have equal weight and validity.

Do multiple abortions make you a better woman, like the person who is a perpetual voter? Cuz some here seem to imply that.

No, actually nobody has. Simply saying that one has had multiple abortions doesn't mean that one is staking a claim to being a better person than anyone who's had just one or none. What has been going on is that the women who have said that they've had abortions do not regret it, and feel like it was the right choice. This stings you into concern-trolling that these women should shut up about their abortions, unless they offend some vaguely defined group into taking action against abortions. Given that, it's hardly surprising that people would question your commitment to supporting the right to have an abortion.

Use a bit of common sense. Realize that if you're not smart enough to use prevention,

This assumes a) that "prevention" is always infallible, and b) that a woman have always been committed to not having a child in order to obtain an abortion, neither of which are necessary nor true. A woman could change her mind about having a child for a variety of reasons. It's not for you or I or anyone to parse those reasons in order to see if the woman seeking an abortion is using her rights "properly". And I can assure you that what you call "prevention" doesn't always prevent.

at least use discretion when advertising of your multiple right to abort. I predict in years to come, depending on where you live, such actions will seem more like privileges than rights, sadly enough.

Right, because being meek and mild about abortion rights is what guaranteed the right in the first place. If there are places where an abortion seems like a "privilege", rather than a right, it's because too few people have been willing to be vocal in its defense. That is the reason behind the "I had an abortion" shirt. It shows that the women who get an abortion are not stereotypical monsters, but neighbors, coworkers, friends, etc. who found themselves making a decision which (if they're wearing the t-shirt) likely made their lives better.

You can also can the "sadly enough", since the pretense of being a concerned supporter of the right to an abortion is not credible.

But hurry. Go have an abortion because if you don't use it, you lose it, seems to be the thinking of some here...

Well, I'd love to but for one salient point: I don't have a womb. I do find it impressive how you're able to speak for the people here with words they never said but complain that I'm "twist[ing] what [you] said" by drawing an inference based on what you've already said.

If women are somehow misusing the right to an abortion by getting one multiple times and saying so, then obviously they cannot be trusted to determine for themselves when a right is "truly needed". It's obvious that you don't trust the women themselves to know when it's truly needed, since you're railling against multiple abortions in the first place. So that determination is, then, left to the whims of a patriarchal society, where men are privileged and women are disadvantaged when it comes to making determinations which affect the lives of other people.

If you don't like the conclusions, start with some different premises.

If women are somehow misusing the right to an abortion by getting one multiple times and saying so, then obviously they cannot be trusted to determine for themselves when a right is "truly needed".

You said that.
Not me.

I'll end it here and come back and visit in a few years when there are women -- not that you'll see them of course -- unable to make choices about this subject legally.

But chances are, if things are ok where you're at, you just won't give a damn.

Hey -- did you kids know that some folks out there are fighting a war? No? See how easy it is to put things out of your mind when you're not directly affected?

Parse that "nullifidian".

If you think practicing the "right" to have an abortion is like practicing the "right" to vote, I can't help your civic stupidity.

The comments to this entry are closed.